WRONG_WOEID WRONG_WOEID

Adventist Church Responds to “Skirt” Concerns

Pastor_Kendol_DoyleAntigua St John's - Youth Director of the Antigua and Barbuda Seventh Day Adventist Coordinating Services, Pastor Kendol Doyle, has responded to the letter “Concerned About Adventists’ Skirts” penned by Joyce Spencer and published by Caribarena, with a message that the notion might have been a bit exaggerated and generalized.

Doyle said off the bat that he was not prepared to “rebut” the position taken by Miss Spencer but having read the publication he was of the opinion that clarity must be provided by the church.



“I must express my disappointment with the whomever it is that issued the letter. Our church does have a standard as it relates to dress and we generally stress the level of modesty, but when it comes to the Pathfinder Club it also has a dress code. In relations to the ladies and the standards for that, their skirts should be no less that two inches below their knees,” the Youth Director said.

He explained that with that in mind, the notion of “short skirts” is completely out of the question as the young ladies are reviewed annually (or as they get taller) to see that they have not outgrown their uniforms and are not in breach of the dress code.

“That is something that the church and the club have as a standard. Every director of the Pathfinder has a manual with the style, length, material and everything that has to do with the uniform and the skirt,” Doyle said.

It was further pointed out that aside from the regulations of the Church, there are several factors that “come into play” including the “different spiritual levels” of the individuals attending. And, as a result of this these, individuals might “flex the rules” in keeping with their level of spirituality.

“In the Church there are people of different ages of development and spiritual maturity and these may exhibit certain characteristics that does not necessarily represent the position of the Church. Another point that one has to take into consideration is that the Pathfinder Club does not only cater for Seventh Day Adventists,” Doyle said.

To this, he pointed out that the club also caters to “individuals in the community” in keeping with their goals and vision for the youth department, and the Church cannot always “enforce its laws” on those individuals regarding the dress and the manner in which they carry themselves.

“What one has to note is that you have some persons that are in our Church who are not rich folks, they are part of the poor or at poverty level, and what sometimes they may wear as an individual may represent what they have and not necessarily what they would have liked to wear.”

Doyle said he could not speak to the manner in which the individual Pathfinder Clubs are managed by the assigned leaders but he has assured that spot-checks are made by himself and other senior members of the Church. These inspections are done at every “congress” and otherwise.

In response to the notion that the general public might have taken the position that the image of the Church could be in jeopardy considering the actions and standards of its youth population, Doyle said he could not necessarily support the idea that the entire future of the church rests on the shoulders of the select few.

“I am not sure how much I can validate that perception… (But) what I would say to that is that the letter makes reference to an experience of some Pathfinders in a particular club.



"We have close to 30 clubs in Antigua and I do not think that if one were to use the rule across the board that they would be able to come up with a general statement that there is a landslide generation lapse in terms of modesty or the dress code.

"What I can say (however) is that dealing with young people is a challenge and we are as a Church endeavoring in our best to keep the standards of the Church in relations to modesty and the mission of the youth department…”



See related stories:

Concerned About Adventists' Skirts

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14 Comments In This Article   

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RE: Adventist Church Responds to “Skirt” Concerns

#14 READER » 2012-11-15 15:04

All of you need to stop, get together to discuss and resolve the issue within the organization and stop belittling your Pastor on the media. Shame on you all.
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READER

RE: Adventist Church Responds to “Skirt” Concerns

#13 Observer » 2012-09-28 08:50

JK, I totally agree with you. How did this letter help the youth, who are wearing short skirts to look for the wrong attention. ALWAYS think of them and not your selfish motive.
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Observer

Skirt Issue in Pathfinder Clubs

#12 Edmond » 2012-09-16 18:45

Pastor Doyle:

The leadership of the pathfinder club(s) involved in this issue need to be advised. Whether a club member is a member of the SDA church or not, the rules and standards of the club must be enforced. Mini skirt is not the standard for pathfinder uniform, so any clubbite who wears inappropriate uniform, irrespective of economic status, must be sanctioned and not allowed to represent the club, and by extension the SDA church, period. The Pathfinder Director(s) of offending clubs must be counselled; the sooner the better!
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Edmond

Mr.

#11 JK » 2012-07-09 15:55

some of you are missing the point the Pastor's intention was not to boast of the number of clubs they have but to demonstrate that her statement was generalizing an issue that may not be grave if it is the one or two of which we should be able to deal with. In his statement also he made aware that the club carries out inspection annually and as you know kids grow fast, in a summer they can grow as much as three inches and perhaps they should wear something else in the mean while until they can get their new uniform. Let us not do the blame game one of the gifts God gave us is the ability speak and express. I am glad that people are still interested in the upbringing of the youths but let us work together not against each other. The hope of these institutions are to mold in our youths characters that will emulate values stemming from christian believes and principles as well as integrating them into society as moral and upstanding citizens. They will be given the tools but yet they have the choice whether to use the tools given to them or not. If we see somebody slipping let them know don't say look at him or her
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JK

Mr.

#10 JK » 2012-07-09 15:55

To chime in here, while i know the article is a bit old let me say i understand and accept the scrutiny with which the SDA church is being held to. This time the concern is with the shortness of Pathfinder girls skirt. I think the responsibility rest with all of us including parents, the church, neighbors and well wishers to help mold our youths instead of laying blame. I do not know how grave the circumstance is with regards to the number of pathfinder girls who are found to be wearing short uniform skirts but let me say a different approach could have been taken, why not discuss it with the leaders instead of putting it out there to the media only to cause contention. It cause me to question her intention, was she really sincere in trying to help improve the outlook of the pathfinders or merely trying to cause doubt in the validity of the pathfinder club.
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JK

RE: Adventist Church Responds to “Skirt” Concerns

#9 LM » 2012-05-21 09:41

Pastor, stop making excuses and deal with the problem. You are encouraging a nation of degenerates. If you dont curb it now, you end up with a bigger problem on your hand. No need to provide the general public with the details of the handbook. Make sure the rules of the handbook are being followed -with no exception. It may also make sense to reach out to the community to really get a sense of what they are seeing, because it is obvious you are blind and we know blind men dont see.
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LM

Send Them Home

#8 Heidi Carson » 2012-05-16 17:12

I have heard adults who were once Pathfinders talk of days when their Pathfinder Leaders would SEND THEM HOME for improper dressing etc. So, if they do not adhere to standards today, SEND THEM HOME! We tend to pet up nonsense too much while the children of today are watching for decency, order and DISCIPLINE. Some parents need to Pull their own socks up too! And I'm not only talking about Church here. When youth make it a HABIT to go to school late and then they get locked out and SENT HOME, they will learn to come early BUT some parents fuss and cuss. Where is the Example? When they fight, SEND THEM HOME, when their uniforms(whether church or school) are too short, SEND THEM HOME. When they REFUSE to adhere to rules, whatever they may be, SEND THEM HOME. If them and their parents want good, they will do better when they get SENT HOME!

P.S - Pastor, next time let the public vent and do not answer them. Just SEND HOME those who will not adhere. If only ONE adheres, then so be it. Let us see today's 'Daniels' shining!
Finally, help the less fortunate (church, buy a skirt or 2) and be sure to strictly outline the expectations of the club to non-SDA youth who join.
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Heidi Carson

same thing me say

#7 Lisroy » 2012-05-08 12:00

I Lisroy said that the SDA church would turn a blind eye and here it is, the evidence in the response. All this man did was boast of the amount of clubs and the standards he think are being upheld.

Now, would you guys hire me as Director? Please :sigh: I'm sure i would do a better job :lol: .
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Lisroy

Mr. Doyle seem confused

#6 Marcia » 2012-05-08 11:36

I feel this leader who responded is probably confused but all who posted from Dr. Watson to Ms. Nicholas are correct. Mr. Doyle you have missed the point!

Persons know your leader, persons know these kids, persons are only crying out for better leadership. No one judged your church or its clubs and so many people cannot be wrong about your leader too.

I would strongly advise that if you are humble enough, you take timeout to be better aware of what's happening in that particular club. Take time out to be a humble christian and not a defensive one. Take time to allow the good Lord to lead and guide your decisions. Never be so quick to defend when the public is crying out to you sir.

I do hope you take heed because your church seem to seriously need help.
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Marcia

@ Youth Director

#5 Ms. Nicholas » 2012-05-06 19:54

Where _____ is bliss...

Mr. Director, would have been better if you had stayed silent. The colors of the church that you are showing, not bright at all. Strong leadership is the cry. Did you not hear, were you not listening? Didn't all those people who posted on the issue mean anything?

Wow is all i could say.
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Ms. Nicholas

Boasting would not help

#4 Melford » 2012-05-06 19:49

:lol: Is this the leadership's response. If yes, then that SDA member who wrote so aptly on behalf of the church must be embar**ed to the bone.

Sir, I can tell you that Ms. Spencer, now Windowed, is a well respected woman. If her husband, paps was alive, i know he would set you straight. Why couldn't you address her as Ms. Spencer, why did you have to refer to her as whomever? Is this they way you all behave?

I am disappointed. I can only say that you seem to be interested in boasting about your standards and the amount of clubs that the SDA church has across Antigua. However, if you don't take this one church in hand or the leadership of that church (Clare HAll) then the amount of clubs you have in Antigua may very well be penetrated by ??? which means that our society will not receive the rightful help from the church that it usually welcomes to make us a more respectful and progressive nation.
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Melford

Director Missing the Point

#3 Preacher B » 2012-05-06 19:30

Mr. Director, I am sure you meant well by defending your co-workers. However, you never dealt with the issue as a leader in your capacity. What you seem to be doing is condoning wrong or you're a great sweeper of things under the rug.

What you have told us is that you know of one standard and that standard is supposed to be upheld by each of your 30 clubs. What you don't understand is that it does not matter how many clubs you have and how long is your list of principles. What matters is that the rules are followed and clearly the Clare Hall SDA Church has not been following your rules and you weren't even aware even though you carry out so many checks (as you said).

I feel sorry for leaders who think they are fooling people or think they are takiing people for a ride.

May you be better inspired and i sincerely wish that those youths spoken of are better lead in the future.
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Preacher B

@ the Youth Director

#2 Will Christian » 2012-05-06 19:23

I fully agree with Dr. Watson. You or your members are responsible for the 30 clubs of which you boast. Then the church values must be reflected in the members of the clubs that your leaders are or should be in control of.

I note with concern the generalization of the response you gave. Are you by any chance covering up for a leader that a lot of people (according to the posts) seem to know as "xxxxxxxx"?

This has now become more interesting. Especially since i notice that one of your members think it's another member who wrote the letter (lol). I know Ms. Spencer and i believe she must be laughing to herself.

What will people think of your church now sir? I would advise you to spend more time training your leaders (no disrespect intended).
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Will Christian

@ Youth Director

#1 Dr. Winston Watson » 2012-05-06 13:20

It's the standard of modesty encouraged rather than manadated? You are dealing with clash between different moral codes, cutlural norms and the post-moderm mind. I am not too sure that the Church in dealing with young people can beat them into modest dress while leaving their unconverted souls in tact. The Church has to model in its lifestyle of adults and love and concern of empowerment for young people the ideals of Adventism. That which is expedient must be balanced with that which is lawful. How are person dresses does not reflect the church' s standard in the same way of how a professed Christian behaves does not lower or improves the holiness of God.
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Dr. Winston Watson

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